[BITList] Interesting story on Luftwaffe Recon Over New York, a WW2 Secret

FA franka at iinet.net.au
Wed Mar 27 03:27:13 GMT 2013


Colin
Thought the planes looked interesting anyone can see that its not true
frank
On 3/27/2013 9:29 AM, x50type wrote:
> Not possible – another hoax!
> [where do you dig these up from, Frank 
> ..............................and why?]
> ct
>
>
>       Kössler and Ott analysis
>
> Karl Kössler and Günter Ott, in their book/Die großen Dessauer: 
> Junkers Ju 89, 90, 290, 390. Die Geschichte einer 
> Flugzeugfamilie/("Great Dessauers...History of an Aircraft Family"), 
> also examined the claimed flight, and thoroughly debunked the flight 
> north of New York. Most importantly, assuming there was only one such 
> aircraft in existence, Kössler and Ott note it was nowhere near France 
> at the time when the flight was supposed to have taken place and 
> therefore could not be in two places at once. According to Hans 
> Pancherz' logbook, the Ju 390 V1 was brought to Prague on 26 November 
> 1943. While there, it took part in a number of test flights, which 
> continued until late March 1944.^[6] 
> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junkers_Ju_390#cite_note-kossler-6>
>
> Secondly, they also assert that the Ju 390 V1 prototype was unlikely 
> to have been capable of taking off with the fuel load necessary for a 
> flight of such duration due to strength concerns due to its modified 
> structure; it would have required a takeoff weight of 65 tonnes (72 
> tons), while the maximum takeoff weight during its trials had been 34 
> tonnes (38 tons). Another explanation for this, however, is that 
> prototypes are never flown at maximum gross weight for their maiden 
> flight until testing can determine the aircraft's handling 
> characteristics. According to Kössler and Ott, the Ju 390 V2 could not 
> have made the U.S. flight either, since they indicate that it was not 
> completed before September/October 1944.^[6] 
> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junkers_Ju_390#cite_note-kossler-6>
>
> *From:* FS <mailto:franka at iinet.net.au>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 26, 2013 6:51 PM
> *To:* BitList <mailto:bitlist at lists.bcn.mythic-beasts.com>
> *Subject:* [BITList] Interesting story on Luftwaffe Recon Over New 
> York,a WW2 Secret
>
>
>
>
>     *Luftwaffe Over New York, a WW2 Secret*
>
>
>         *http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/03/11/86523/screenhunter_17-mar-11-20-20/
>         <http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/03/11/86523/screenhunter_17-mar-11-20-20/>*
>
>
>         *The Most Dangerous Photo-Recon Mission of World War II*
>
>     By Jim Newsom U.S.A.
>     On August 27th 1943, a German Luftwaffe long-range photo
>     reconnaissance bomber, a Junkers Ju-390 took off from its base in
>     Norway and flew out across the Atlantic Ocean. Among its four man
>     crew was a brave and daring woman Anna Kreisling, the ‘White Wolf
>     of the Luftwaffe’. A nickname she had acquired because of her
>     frost blonde hair and icy blue eyes. Anna was one of the top
>     pilots in Germany and even though she was only the co-pilot on
>     this mission, her flying ability was crucial to its success.
>     The Ju-390 was twice the size of the B-29 Superfortress. It was
>     powered by six 1,500 hp BMW radial engines and it had a range of
>     18,000 miles without refuelling.
>     *This was to be the longest photo-recon mission flown by an enemy
>     airplane in World War II. Nine hours later, the Junkers was over
>     Canada and swinging south at an altitude of 22,000 feet. In the
>     next few hours, it would photograph the heavy industrial plants in
>     Michigan that were vital to the United States.*
>
>     *http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/03/11/86523/screenhunter_18-mar-11-20-21/
>     <http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/03/11/86523/screenhunter_18-mar-11-20-21/>*
>
>     *By noon on August 28th the gigantic six engined bomber was over
>     New York City, where it finally was spotted by the US Army Air
>     Corp. but by then it was too late. The Junkers disappeared into
>     the vastness of the Atlantic Ocean, fourteen hours later, Anna
>     would bring the huge bomber in to land at a Luftwaffe base outside
>     of Paris.*
>     Thoughts of this mission came to mind as I sat across the table
>     from Anna Kreisling at a recent Octoberfest in Los Angeles. She is
>     still quite beautiful with her icy blonde hair tied-back in a
>     pony-tail and her radiant blue eyes, which have seen events in
>     human history only a few of us could ever imagine.
>     She had flown Ju-52 Trimotors into the streets of Stalingrad when
>     it had been surrounded by the Red Army. Many times her plane had
>     been riddled with bullets so badly that she landed with only one
>     engine running while the other two were on fire.
>     In 1945 she was assigned to fly the jet fighters that Germany was
>     producing.
>     One of these jet fighters was the Horten V9 flying wing. It was
>     powered by two Jumo turbo-jet engines, which enabled it to fly at
>     600 mph. It was armed with two 30mm cannon and air to air missiles.
>     Anna never scored any victories in the Horten. While taxing in the
>     snow an American Sherman tank crew captured her after she had
>     turned off the engine and pulling off her flight helmet they
>     thought she was a movie star!! For the next six months she poured
>     coffee for the US Army and did not spend one night in a POW camp.
>     Everyone thought she was part of Bob Hope’s USO show!!
>     P.S. An article in Air Progress magazine in the Nov/Dec issue 1965
>     also talked about the Junkers Ju-390 over-flying Michigan and New
>     York. This was held top secret throughout World War II and the
>     Cold War.
>     If you look in books they will say that only two Ju-390s were
>     built, when in fact there were around 11 built. Also they were
>     used in Odessa, Russia to fly to Japanese held fields in China.
>     Very secret jet engines and technology was traded for raw
>     materials. At Area 51 in Nevada the United States Air Force it is
>     rumored has a Junkers Ju-390 it captured during Operation
>     Paperclip toward the end of World War II.
>     ——————————————————————————–
>
>
>               *Notes:*
>
>     1) Anna was a test pilot so her mentioned with the Ho V9 (IX)
>     prototypes is provisional as I believe that Pacific Flyer added
>     the comments about it being armed and her never scoring any
>     victories in it. It never became operational as the production Go-229.
>     2) What is written about her and flying jet fighters either refers
>     to her test-flying them out of context or Hitlers order in March
>     1945 for 7-10 days allowing Hanna Reitsch to form a female jet
>     fighter unit and them rescinding that order.
>     3) the Ju-390 production definitely is off officially as there
>     were more than 2 of them in several different places during the
>     war that the 2 could not cover. Historians lack the specific
>     information on the other builds and especially usage from KG 200
>     and also why the SS forbid Baur to use the Ju-390 as
>     Führerflugzeug. It is believed that the aircraft in Norway and
>     Prague were reserved for Himmler and Kammler instead and that
>     Kammler escaped with the Bell Device in one of those.
>     ————————————————————————————–
>
>
>         *http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/03/11/86523/screenhunter_19-mar-11-20-22/
>         <http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/03/11/86523/screenhunter_19-mar-11-20-22/>FLYING
>         THE JUNKERS 52/3m at STALINGRAD*
>
>     /By Jim Newsom/
>     The following is an interview with Anna Kreisling – The White Wolf
>     of the Luftwaffe- of what it was like to fly the Junkers Ju-52/3m
>     trimotor in World War II.
>     James: How many Lady pilots flew with the Luftwaffe in World War II?
>     Anna: At the beginning of the war there were 50 pilots that flew
>     transport aircraft, and there were many more who trained our young
>     fledgling pilots, but both Hitler and Goering were against women
>     flying fighters and bombers in combat. In Russia there were many
>     women that flew fighters and bombers for Stalin.
>     James: I have flown in the Ford Trimotor, The Junkers Ju-52/3m has
>     always been one of my favorite airplanes, what was it like to fly?
>     Anna: The Junkers was an amazing and beautiful aircraft to fly! At
>     Stalingrad sometimes I made take-offs with only two engines
>     running. If you had only one engine running you could maintain
>     altitude. Visibility was wonderful, but the Junkers was a complex
>     aircraft and you needed a great instructor if you wanted to learn
>     quickly how to fly the trimotor.
>     James: You mentioned Stalingrad, was that the nightmare we read so
>     much about in history books?
>     Anna: Stalingrad was a living hell, but what happened at Crete was
>     far worse. For our airborne assault on Crete we had over 450
>     Junkers Ju-52 trimotors filled with paratroopers. We were told
>     that we would not encounter ack ack flak, and taking the island
>     would be easy. However, the island was filled with Australian, New
>     Zealand, and British troops who fought like hell and we lost over
>     half our planes and troops taking that island. I was not there; I
>     was lucky because I was based at France at the time. We lost so
>     many good pilots and men at Crete. We would have won the war
>     against Russia if we had saved those planes and men.
>     James: Speaking of Russia, tell me about Stalingrad.
>     Anna: For many years I could not talk about it, it was too
>     terrible. Göring who had promised Hitler that he could re-supply
>     Stalingrad from the air had no idea what he was talking about. Von
>     Paulus and the 6th Army should have been ordered to fight their
>     way out. But Hitler agreed to airlift when Paulus agreed to stay,
>     that victory was near.
>
>
>             *An Examination of Hitler’s Decision to Airlift*
>
>     The Junkers Ju-52/3m flew 95% of all the missions into Stalingrad.
>     Other planes also flew in this massive airlift, but the Junkers
>     was the workhorse. The nightmare was crashing into Stalingrad
>     itself. If you were captured by the Russians, they brutally
>     tortured you before they would kill you. At Stalingrad we had over
>     7,000 women working in the German Army that Hitler wanted flown
>     out because what the Russians would do to them.
>
>     http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/03/11/86523/screenhunter_20-mar-11-20-23/
>     <http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/03/11/86523/screenhunter_20-mar-11-20-23/>
>
>     At Stalingrad we had over 350,000 men fighting the communist
>     hordes, but it was not enough. We didn’t have enough fuel,
>     fighters, trained mechanics, and even decent runways to work with.
>     I usually flew out of Tatsinskaya with food and supplies loaded
>     aboard. I also carried three gunners, two in the waist position
>     and one on top. At Stalingrad Russian Yaks were everywhere and our
>     losses were grim.
>     The Russian Yak was very similar to the British Spitfire, very
>     manoeuvrable and fast. If they came out of the sun and caught you
>     by surprise, it was all over. However, many Russian pilots made
>     the mistake of approaching slowly from behind and that is when my
>     young men would shoot them down.
>     Once I heard of a gunner who ran out of ammunition, and in
>     desperation threw toilet paper at the Russian Yak, and the Russian
>     was frightened away by it!! The Russians did not know what toilet
>     paper was, so this pilot probably thought the gunner was throwing
>     a bomb at him. This trick worked many times.
>     James: What were the casualties at Stalingrad?
>     Anna: We lost 800 Ju-52 trimotors at Stalingrad, so many great
>     superb pilots we lost. Germany never recovered from these losses.
>     Hitler should have resigned and the High Command surrendered to
>     the Americans and British. I only survived through luck and
>     determination not to be captured by the Russians. It is easy to be
>     brave with two engines on fire when the alternative is to be
>     captured by the Russians.
>     James: Is there anything you would like to say to the young people
>     today?
>     Anna: Yes, flying is a great adventure, it is a joy that is
>     boundless, but try to do your flying when people are not trying to
>     shoot you down. Flying into Stalingrad was not fun, but we had to
>     do it, we could not let so many young men die. The future will be
>     better for everyone if we could be at peace and flying could be
>     enjoyed for what it is, the most fun that you can have!! The
>     memories of flying the Alps in a Junkers Ju-52/3m will be with me
>     forever!!
>
>     .
>
>     //
>
>     //
>
>     __
>
>
>
>
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